20 june 2023, Wouter van den Eijkel
The studio of... Marie Pop
In Le Studio Perdu, Marie Pop takes you to the Parisian artists' studios of the early 20th century – back to the artist's life of yesteryear and the emerging Surrealism, but also addressing the underexposed role of female artists in Parisian studios. A perfect cross-over between photography and painting with a dark sense of humour, Marie Pop's work often has a feminist edge. "A 'female gaze' as a counterpart to the ubiquitous male gaze is desperately needed!" A conversation with Anique Weve and Inge Aanstoot, the duo behind Marie Pop, about their studio, their collaboration and current exhibition at Contour Gallery in Rotterdam.
Together you form Marie Pop, but you work in different disciplines. Each discipline usually has different requirements for a studio space, hence the question: do you share a studio or do you transport your work from Anique's studio to Inge's?
We always try to let Marie Pop be an artist in her own right, an individual instead of a duo. That may sound a bit strange, but it ensures that the artistic choices Marie makes are genuinely about the work. This way, none of our individual disciplines or ideas get the upper hand. Inge is originally a painter who occasionally ventures into graphic printing. Anique studied film and has done numerous socially engaged performances, but has been working for a long time with photography as her main medium.
Natuurlijk vormt de combinatie van schilderkunst en fotografie wel een belangrijk deel van Maries werk. Wij delen geen atelier, maar onze ateliers bevinden zich wel in hetzelfde atelierpand, bij Stichting B.a.d te Rotterdam. Het feit dat we zo dicht bij elkaar kwamen werken was destijds dan ook een van de aanleidingen om Marie Pop in het leven te roepen.
Of course, the combination of painting and photography is an important part of Marie's work. We do not share a studio, but our studios are located in the same studio building, at Stichting B.a.d in Rotterdam. The fact that we ended up working so close to each other was one of the reasons that we created Marie Pop.
In the end, we take a lot of pictures in Anique's studio and much of the editing takes place in Inge's room. Every studio is simply set up for this: Anique works well with the light in her studio and has everything from cameras and tripods to negative scanners and reflection screens at home, while Inge has everything ready to get started with painting. Everything else, from the development of ideas and design to casting plaster and making costumes, takes place wherever is best: sometimes in one of the two studios, sometimes at one of our homes, sometimes at a coffee shop or in the garden.
Studio Marie Pop
What makes a good studio for you?
For Marie Pop, it is especially important that we can both work together and focus on our work separately. We work out every idea together, but in some steps of the creative process, it is simply not convenient to be in the same room. When it comes to digitally editing the negatives, Inge simply trusts in Anique's skills, and when painting on the photo prints, it is the other way around. You really don't have to look over each other's shoulder, which makes it nice to have your own workplace. The work of art to be made is discussed together and we also show each other what crosses our path, what we encounter in the process, what is thrown into our laps. There are, of course, also practical matters to consider. Good light, for example, is important for both of us. But the social component, also broader than Marie Pop, is also important. If we didn’t have a studio in a building with another 20 or so artists, with whom we can drink coffee, organise things or talk about our work, Marie Pop might never have been born.
Marie Pop, Camille Claudel, 2023, Contour Gallery
You are a duo with a clear division of roles (Anique takes photographs while Inge paints). How did your collaboration come about? What did you recognise in each other's work?
Anique was the first to suggest that we exhibit together. She immediately recognised a certain sense of dark humour in Inge's work and similarities in the use of symbolism and aesthetics. Oddly enough, many people don't see that, or at least not right away. Anique's work is often quite peaceful, while Inge's paintings are usually very crowded and busy. Yet Inge immediately recognised a link. There is also a certain way of telling stories in both oeuvres.
It did not immediately amount to an exhibition. A little while later, Anique was working on a project and asked other artists to work over her pictures. For example, Daan Den Houter melted his ice paintings over her work. She had also previously planned to paint on her own pictures. She put two and two together and asked Inge if she would like to try working together.
The first attempts felt a bit forced and perhaps a bit cartoonish, but once a good reason was found for a series of works, Marie really took off. Musician Mark Lotterman, a good friend of Inge’s, launched his project 'Holland'. He had asked artists to respond visually to one of the songs on his upcoming album of the same name. The first real series of works by Marie Pop became a fact – and that left us wanting more.
How do you go about your work? You probably start with the photos, but do you discuss the subject beforehand or do you work more associatively?
Actually, the pictures are not the first step. We first brainstorm about what we want to create. We tell each other what inspires us, collect (visual) material to explain it, and this results in a theme or central idea. We then think about how an image should look. We don't both with all the details; there needs to also be the opportunity to discover, add or omit things along the way. With Marie's first works, we did most of the steps together, but now we rely more on each other's skills and insight. We still consult each other during every step, but we don't ask for 'permission' for every little thing.
Inge is usually in the studio when Anique takes photographs. To brainstorm and help with light screens and other practical matters, but not to look through the viewfinder with every picture. We agree on the atmosphere and Inge has a good idea about what the picture will look like. Anique scans and edits the negatives (she usually shoots analogue) alone. That's often where we start trying out some older ideas on the pictures. Sometimes these are detailed sketches on A4 sheets, especially in the beginning, but often also a verbal explanation or a quick sketch on a smartphone.
Inge then sets to work. She shares her progress with Anique regularly to get input, whether in person or digitally by sending a photo via WhatsApp or email. Not every feather, egg or droplet Inge paints has been thought out together, but it’s not like Anique doesn’t contribute once Inge has completed the print.
Marie Pop, Gorilla, 2023, Contour Gallery
Your exhibition at Contour is called Le Studio Perdu. You take viewers to Parisian artist studios of the early 20th century. Why this time period?
In that era, the use of photography in art was growing in popularity, both as an autonomous medium and as an aid for painters. Not only that, but pictures of artists in their studios were also being taken for the first time. Sometimes documentary, sometimes as an autonomous work and sometimes as a combination of the two – and sometimes it’s not clear which of the above applies. That is, of course, very interesting: are you watching a staged performance or did that studio really look like that? And, of course, there is a certain romanticism to those Parisian studios. Artists lived on wine, paint and next to nothing, but were free, happy and highly gifted… or was that image also staged? Surrealism also emerged at this time, a movement in which we recognise a lot of our own work, both Marie's and our separate oeuvres. And there’s that particular sense of humour.
There is also often a feminist edge to Marie Pop's work. There were more women in those Parisian studios than you find in the history books. They were often simply spitefully eliminated, only being allowed to be muses and models, even though there were also fantastic female artists at that time, as well as non-binary artists such as Claude Cahun. The famous urinal Fontaine, signed 'R. Mutt', is today usually still attributed to artist Marcel Duchamp, while everything indicates that it was made by Elsa von Freytag.
In 1989, the Guerilla Girls launched a campaign asking, “Do women have to be naked to get into the Met. Museum?” and female artists are still poorly represented in major collections. The fact that it was made difficult for non-male artists from earlier times to become famous at all plays a role, but part of that history has also been erased or overlooked. This is also a theme we find very important and that we want to see reflected in Marie's work.
Marie Pop, Maestà _Luna, 2021, Contour Gallery
Le Studio Perdu is about the role of women in those studios. Are you mainly interested in female artists or also the models and muses and therefore the male interpretation of beauty/femininity?
In an ideal world, there would be a good balance between male, female and other artists, models and muses, without having to worry about that kind of representation and interpretation. As long as that balance is not there, we think it is important to do something about it. We chose the name Marie Pop deliberately. Although usually associated with women, Marie is also used as a male name and Marie Pop can be anyone she wants to be. In this case, Marie shows a feminine side, in terms of models and muses and in the artists that inspire her. A 'female gaze' as a counterpart to the ubiquitous male gaze is desperately needed!
Surrealism and romance are the main ingredients of the new series, but as mentioned earlier, also the male gaze and role of the woman in those studios. When did you discover that these subjects and themes could be combined?
The male gaze is still often the only starting point for many stories, not only in visual arts and film, but also on television and in music. It is also difficult to change that, as it has become so intertwined with all aspects of life. Introducing more variety and balance is difficult, but feminism is something you should not only think about, but also do. What Marie can do is offer a feminine perspective and highlight themes related to this. Marie Pop's work is not just meant to be activist; it is not a banner or pamphlet, but the input of these ideas is important for the final outcome. The works must be able to stand on their own, be able to stimulate, but they can perhaps do that even more by choosing such a perspective.
Marie Pop, meerdere werken Le Studio Perdu, Contour Gallery
The press release states that creation and the process itself are central to this series. Is that also something that applies to your work: is it more about the process or the result?
The working method in the studio is indeed important in this series. In a studio, you usually make much more than is ever exhibited. Things fail, sketches are not worked out, ideas get stuck. Yet all those things are part of the creative process, and very important too. Sometimes, things don't end up in the public eye that would have added something to the world. There is also a parallel with those forgotten female artists from history.
What are you currently working on?
Right now, we’re still busy working on a series of works for the exhibition Le Studio Perdu. A big part of what we're showing at Contour Gallery will be a series of how ideas bounce around the studio: trying, erasing, trying something different, starting all over again... We are also exploring a number of new techniques, which we think are a good next step for Marie, which is wonderful, but also difficult because it means that we also have to get used to new techniques. Right now, we’re working on sculptural, ceramic work, but are also toying with an idea involving an etching press. Only time will tell whether and how that will be take place. Maybe this should also bounce around the studio for a while – and we'll see if anything ever comes of it.
Marie Pop, Art Rotterdam 2021, Contour Gallery
